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	<title>Comments on: Testing the Ice</title>
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	<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/</link>
	<description>Blogging Postmodern Blackness</description>
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		<title>By: Talking about Race &#171; UUCIF Social Justice</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1206</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Talking about Race &#171; UUCIF Social Justice]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 04:38:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1206</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Testing the Ice on The Bottom of Heaven: Blogging Postmodern Blackness [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Testing the Ice on The Bottom of Heaven: Blogging Postmodern Blackness [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Holly</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1200</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Holly]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Mar 2010 04:26:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1200</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Great topic.  I&#039;m bothered by parents who say, &#039;kids don&#039;t see color&#039; -- what?  Of course they do.  What they haven&#039;t got yet is the context of it -- and THAT is what we should be helping them shape by talking about race NOW.  Sometimes I worry I lay it on thick with my 6-year old.  He&#039;s all I KNOW MOM because I talk about history and race and the ridiculousness of hate.  The kid learns in two languages each day and is proficient in a third, he&#039;s lived abroad, and he gets that people are different... so I&#039;ve backed off.  I was beginning to feel like I was trying to instill white guilt in him early, when what I was really trying to do was get him primed to set the stage about him understanding white privilege as he gets older.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great topic.  I&#8217;m bothered by parents who say, &#8216;kids don&#8217;t see color&#8217; &#8212; what?  Of course they do.  What they haven&#8217;t got yet is the context of it &#8212; and THAT is what we should be helping them shape by talking about race NOW.  Sometimes I worry I lay it on thick with my 6-year old.  He&#8217;s all I KNOW MOM because I talk about history and race and the ridiculousness of hate.  The kid learns in two languages each day and is proficient in a third, he&#8217;s lived abroad, and he gets that people are different&#8230; so I&#8217;ve backed off.  I was beginning to feel like I was trying to instill white guilt in him early, when what I was really trying to do was get him primed to set the stage about him understanding white privilege as he gets older.</p>
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		<title>By: Claudia</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1197</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Claudia]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 18:11:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1197</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks for stopping by, RL. I&#039;m a bit horrified by the story of your first grade experience. No, a lot horrified. I can only hope that our own knowledge of these things will encourage us to ask more questions when it comes to our children. Racism has a way of being subtle and insidious like that. Awful, just awful.

Oh, and thanks for the Howard C. Stevenson reference!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for stopping by, RL. I&#8217;m a bit horrified by the story of your first grade experience. No, a lot horrified. I can only hope that our own knowledge of these things will encourage us to ask more questions when it comes to our children. Racism has a way of being subtle and insidious like that. Awful, just awful.</p>
<p>Oh, and thanks for the Howard C. Stevenson reference!</p>
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		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1196</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[RL]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 01:21:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1196</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Though I&#039;m not yet a mom, I can certainly appreciate this post, Claudia, on more than one level. This semester, I&#039;m teaching an Intro to Black Psychology course. Two weeks ago, the topic was &quot;Racial Socialization&quot; which is characterized by educating our children about race and racism so that *when* racism happens, our children will have some context with which to cope and some understanding of how others may perceive them. FYI, Howard C. Stevenson, UPenn, is the primary psychology researcher in this area. Of course, there&#039;s discussion  to the contrary that the goal will backfire and that children will internalize racist beliefs rather than becoming fully functioning members of society. In class, I posed a discussion question regarding whether White couples adopting Black children from Haiti were responsible for socializing these children, racially. Though some folks were conflicted, the overwhelming majority of my 60% Black/40% White class agreed. 

My first recalled experience of racism (though I didn&#039;t know to call it that at the time (but was disgusted by it later), was in first grade down in Savannah, GA. I was 1 of 2 Black students in my class. I was always eager to answer questions that were raised in class, but my teacher typically ignored me. Next thing I knew, I was removed from the class and put in one that was all Black. Later, I realized that I&#039;d been moved from the top (gifted) class to the &quot;third&quot; class.  In the new class, I was bored and typically helped my classmates get their work done. When I asked my mom about this some years ago, she said that they justified this and she didn&#039;t know to challenge it. The error of my placement wasn&#039;t  discovered until 4th grade when I was &quot;retested&quot; and subsquently placed in gifted classes. All that my parents ever told me about race was that I would have to &quot;work twice as hard to get half as far&quot;. Perhaps if they told me more about racism, I would I have known to *check* Miss Pullen :-).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Though I&#8217;m not yet a mom, I can certainly appreciate this post, Claudia, on more than one level. This semester, I&#8217;m teaching an Intro to Black Psychology course. Two weeks ago, the topic was &#8220;Racial Socialization&#8221; which is characterized by educating our children about race and racism so that *when* racism happens, our children will have some context with which to cope and some understanding of how others may perceive them. FYI, Howard C. Stevenson, UPenn, is the primary psychology researcher in this area. Of course, there&#8217;s discussion  to the contrary that the goal will backfire and that children will internalize racist beliefs rather than becoming fully functioning members of society. In class, I posed a discussion question regarding whether White couples adopting Black children from Haiti were responsible for socializing these children, racially. Though some folks were conflicted, the overwhelming majority of my 60% Black/40% White class agreed. </p>
<p>My first recalled experience of racism (though I didn&#8217;t know to call it that at the time (but was disgusted by it later), was in first grade down in Savannah, GA. I was 1 of 2 Black students in my class. I was always eager to answer questions that were raised in class, but my teacher typically ignored me. Next thing I knew, I was removed from the class and put in one that was all Black. Later, I realized that I&#8217;d been moved from the top (gifted) class to the &#8220;third&#8221; class.  In the new class, I was bored and typically helped my classmates get their work done. When I asked my mom about this some years ago, she said that they justified this and she didn&#8217;t know to challenge it. The error of my placement wasn&#8217;t  discovered until 4th grade when I was &#8220;retested&#8221; and subsquently placed in gifted classes. All that my parents ever told me about race was that I would have to &#8220;work twice as hard to get half as far&#8221;. Perhaps if they told me more about racism, I would I have known to *check* Miss Pullen :-).</p>
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		<title>By: Claudia</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1195</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Claudia]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:46:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1195</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hahahaha! Okay, so let me be clear: it&#039;s the refrain, &quot;Good morning blues, how do you do? I&#039;m doing alright, good morning how are you?&quot; that we sing to one another. And it is awfully cute. Clearly I haven&#039;t had a problem introducing her to some things a little early.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hahahaha! Okay, so let me be clear: it&#8217;s the refrain, &#8220;Good morning blues, how do you do? I&#8217;m doing alright, good morning how are you?&#8221; that we sing to one another. And it is awfully cute. Clearly I haven&#8217;t had a problem introducing her to some things a little early.</p>
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		<title>By: Wilhelmina Jenkins</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1194</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Wilhelmina Jenkins]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:13:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1194</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This is a perfect moment for YouTube!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a perfect moment for YouTube!</p>
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		<title>By: Wilhelmina Jenkins</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1193</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Wilhelmina Jenkins]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:12:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1193</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Friendship does not require a perfect score on the race test. Probably a good sense of humor about race works as well as anything else. I may tease my white friends when they are off-base about a racial issue, but it doesn&#039;t affect the friendship. I still haven&#039;t broken one of my better friends of saying she&#039;s color-blind, but I do tease her about it. What does restrict friendships is holding back for fear of offense. Hey, if I have any dumb questions about Italians, you are the first person I&#039;ll ask! (And, boy, jo, can you write! I love the &quot;toes&quot; analogy!)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Friendship does not require a perfect score on the race test. Probably a good sense of humor about race works as well as anything else. I may tease my white friends when they are off-base about a racial issue, but it doesn&#8217;t affect the friendship. I still haven&#8217;t broken one of my better friends of saying she&#8217;s color-blind, but I do tease her about it. What does restrict friendships is holding back for fear of offense. Hey, if I have any dumb questions about Italians, you are the first person I&#8217;ll ask! (And, boy, jo, can you write! I love the &#8220;toes&#8221; analogy!)</p>
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		<title>By: jo</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1192</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Feb 2010 18:36:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1192</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[thanks for engaging with me on this. this is what happens to me. if i have a question about race to which i just do not know the answer, i don&#039;t ask my black friends, because a. what if the question is offensive? b. what if i should totally know the answer already? c. what if they do not want to be/are fed up of being the spokespersons for their race? so i ask my white friends.

facebook has a more impersonal approach, in the sense that i can say something about race there without addressing it to any particular friend in my friends&#039; list. but interracial conversations about race, even on facebook, are, it seems to me, very much coated with a strain of over-politeness and guardedness. 

maybe we should all be a little less afraid. we are inevitably going to step on each other&#039;s toes, whether we talk about race or eating meat. but there is no other way. maybe stepping on each other&#039;s toes will make us all a bit more appreciative of each other&#039;s bodies -- the delicate shape of each digit, the three little phalanxes that compose it, the nice little moon of a nail at the tip, the color of the nailpolish. i think we should simply talk, say what we think, write WTF when WTF is our reaction, be polite but be open and try to make conversations across races flourish. the internet is a great tool for this. we are much more likely to meet here than at the supermarket, because, alas, we tend to go to different supermarkets. at least in miami and los angeles. which are the only two US cities i know.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thanks for engaging with me on this. this is what happens to me. if i have a question about race to which i just do not know the answer, i don&#8217;t ask my black friends, because a. what if the question is offensive? b. what if i should totally know the answer already? c. what if they do not want to be/are fed up of being the spokespersons for their race? so i ask my white friends.</p>
<p>facebook has a more impersonal approach, in the sense that i can say something about race there without addressing it to any particular friend in my friends&#8217; list. but interracial conversations about race, even on facebook, are, it seems to me, very much coated with a strain of over-politeness and guardedness. </p>
<p>maybe we should all be a little less afraid. we are inevitably going to step on each other&#8217;s toes, whether we talk about race or eating meat. but there is no other way. maybe stepping on each other&#8217;s toes will make us all a bit more appreciative of each other&#8217;s bodies &#8212; the delicate shape of each digit, the three little phalanxes that compose it, the nice little moon of a nail at the tip, the color of the nailpolish. i think we should simply talk, say what we think, write WTF when WTF is our reaction, be polite but be open and try to make conversations across races flourish. the internet is a great tool for this. we are much more likely to meet here than at the supermarket, because, alas, we tend to go to different supermarkets. at least in miami and los angeles. which are the only two US cities i know.</p>
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		<title>By: carleen</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1191</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[carleen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Feb 2010 18:15:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1191</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I know this isn&#039;t the point, but...your daughter sings Leadbelly?! That is officially the cutest thing EVER.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know this isn&#8217;t the point, but&#8230;your daughter sings Leadbelly?! That is officially the cutest thing EVER.</p>
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		<title>By: Claudia</title>
		<link>http://thebottomofheaven.com/2010/02/27/testing-the-ice/#comment-1190</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Claudia]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Feb 2010 12:00:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebottomofheaven.com/?p=3648#comment-1190</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hmmm...the pressure to &quot;get it right&quot; does keep many of us silent. We hold ourselves up to some pretty high standards, don&#039;t we? But I agree with Mina, that honesty and willingness to learn about others is a good place to start.

So where/when/what would these real conversations and teaching moments look like? I mean, do Facebook/Twitter/Goodreads threads lack the kind of substance you&#039;d like to see, jo? Because I&#039;ve found that I have more mixed friendships online than in person and sometimes, more honest conversations too. Although they may be brief. But then again, I&#039;m not exactly saying anything too controversial on Twitter.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm&#8230;the pressure to &#8220;get it right&#8221; does keep many of us silent. We hold ourselves up to some pretty high standards, don&#8217;t we? But I agree with Mina, that honesty and willingness to learn about others is a good place to start.</p>
<p>So where/when/what would these real conversations and teaching moments look like? I mean, do Facebook/Twitter/Goodreads threads lack the kind of substance you&#8217;d like to see, jo? Because I&#8217;ve found that I have more mixed friendships online than in person and sometimes, more honest conversations too. Although they may be brief. But then again, I&#8217;m not exactly saying anything too controversial on Twitter.</p>
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